Re: [DIYbio] Re: I had idea on biospheres.

On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 10:47 PM, Jay Woods <woodsjay@cox.net> wrote:
> There are eliptical orbits (but much slower) that shuttle between Earth and
> Mars using a minimum of fuel. This allows for a much larger vessel to be
> accumulated which can start out on an unmanned basis to transfer stuff to
> Mars and back. After enough shielding and later a food production facility
> is accumulated, manned operation can be started.

Yes, these are the Mars cycler trajectories I've been talking about on
this thread -- where I've argued that you might as well start out with
an unmanned closed ecological life support system just to help
calibrate that ecosystem and its shielding (and other variables) for
an eventual crew environment.

If a cycler is also a rotating system that can simulate Mars gravity,
so much the better -- long-duration studies of possible ecosystem
performance under Mars gravity are enabled, without concern for
forward contamination.

As I've mentioned previously, the cycler's rotation might also be used
as a way to help sling Mars probes into Mars orbit or into Mars
atmospheric entry trajectories (and to help land probes on Phobos);
the initial cyclers could thereby serve two purposes related to
figuring out what kind of manned Mars mission to actually execute. 20
years of experience with them might give us almost 10 round-trips even
with a single cycler. This would provide a lot of testing and learning
possibilities. It's a lot more Mars-visit frequency than we're getting
now; it could be a boon to the search for life (past or present.) It's
also a lot more cosmic ray and solar storm exposure than we have to
work with now. There are still a lot of radiation biology unknowns
with that kind of exposure.

Regards,
Michael Turner
Project Persephone
1-25-33 Takadanobaba
Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 169-0075
(+81) 90-5203-8682
turner@projectpersephone.org
http://www.projectpersephone.org/

"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward
together in the same direction." -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry




> On Sunday, October 28, 2012 06:17:04 AM Mega wrote:
>
> We've gone far away from biology, haven't we?
>
>
> Well, when you said one would need radiation shielding, I thought of a
> spacecraft that resembles the "500 Bio Dollar approach". Because "Mars
> direct" *needs* lower shielding. I think the study/report was done by the
> (father of G.W.B) Bush administration. Meaning the craft has roughly the
> mass of the ISS.
> And if the life supporting systems are done by algae in aquarium as someone
> above said, you would need big aquariums. If the aquarium has 2meters*2
> meters *1 meter, you would have 4 tons of water. For a spacecraft that has
> 400 tonnes, that'd be ok, if it also provides oxygen and cleans the air from
> CO2.
> For a Mars Direct approach, 4 tons is much more, meaning the plan to fail
> perhaps.
>
>
>
>
> I'm not american, so I've got no big overview on who ceases plutonium
> production, but obviously it was under the Obama administration. I like
> biology far more than those politics, which determine the kind of transport
> used. Technology is not the limiting factor, by far not. Money is.
> Also, the original issue then was Biospheres on Mars, not how to get them
> there. I'm no expert in that, just know and apply the rocket equation and
> some hohmann transfer orbit theory.
>
> And more in detail, I was inerested in bacteria producing biospheres by
> making greenhouse gasses. You just would have to take 1 Gramm of bacteria to
> Mars, and they would multiply and do the job. No big deal, hwo you get them
> there, each rover could carry that payload.
>
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