Re: [DIYbio] Re: *experienced* beginner is creating a bioluminescent plant - both synbio and old-fashioned way

I'm specifically talking about the EU. I'm not sure there are much in
the way of federal laws banning GMO plants in the U.S.. I know local
laws can make an impact on crops planted, but is it wrong to think
certification isn't required if it's not immediately (a few trophic
levels) going into the human food chain?

On Sun, May 5, 2013 at 11:17 PM, Mega <masterstorm123@gmail.com> wrote:
> Don't know that. Perhapas yes. That's the problem, The american law system
> is based on how similar cases were decided earlier . If there's no smilar
> case, if rather may be legal. In Europe, no chance - GMO = bad.
>
>
> But what is strange: I heared it's totaly legal to expose plants to
> radioactivity and then choose the mutants with beneficial traits. That is
> paranoid, because targeted mutation is forbidden, but random mutatuin with
> all dangers is allowed?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Monday, May 6, 2013 12:27:47 AM UTC+2, Nathan McCorkle wrote:
>>
>> would some sort of site-directed mutagenesis count? Select for cells with
>> lots of repeating junk and mutate it into what you want.
>>
>> On May 5, 2013 2:28 PM, "Cathal Garvey (Phone)"
>> <cathal...@cathalgarvey.me> wrote:
>>>
>>> Not a hope: law in EU is, while more paranoid, certainly better
>>> implemented to do what it's intended to than the US. That is, there's no
>>> "forbidden" or "permitted" lists (Ahem select agents), instead *Every* GMO
>>> is taken as a separate entity requiring a risk assessment.
>>>
>>> So, in EU a gmo of a gmo is a new gmo.
>>>
>>> Nathan McCorkle <nmz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Bump. Would that be a legit way to get around GMO approval? (that is,
>>>> GMing a GMO)
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 24, 2013 3:21 PM, "Nathan McCorkle" <nmz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Can you just start with an already approved GMO strain, and add on mods
>>>>> then without needing to get re-approved? Glowing corn kernels would be
>>>>> pretty damn sweet!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 3:09 PM, Cathal Garvey
>>>>> <cathal...@cathalgarvey.me> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>>> Hash: SHA256
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry, didn't follow the link; was only answering the question as I
>>>>>> saw it: "a gene native to many plant species". Which doesn't, by
>>>>>> itself, mean cisgenic.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, if it's from A.thaliana, then you can use it without a license in
>>>>>> most EU states as it doesn't count as "Transgenic".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And no, there's no generational lapse to GMO status in Europe. Once
>>>>>> you put the black magic in, EU law regards it as black magic forever.
>>>>>> However, you can undergo a process of "deregulation" for GMOs, if you
>>>>>> can "prove" that it's totally safe. In practise, doing so is harder
>>>>>> than getting a drug approved, and in most countries it's ruinously
>>>>>> expensive. So, it virtually never happens: the only guys who can
>>>>>> afford to do it are the guys the law was written by idiots to impede:
>>>>>> megacorps.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 04/24/2013 10:45 PM, Nathan McCorkle wrote:
>>>>>> > Cathal, the paper mentions it IS an A. thaliana gene. The indiegogo
>>>>>> > mentions using A. thaliana... does that get around the laws?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Is there something that after X number of natural generations, the
>>>>>> > plant seeds are no longer considered GMO?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 2:25 PM, Cathal Garvey
>>>>>> > <cathal...@cathalgarvey.me
>>>>>> > <mailto:cathal...@cathalgarvey.me>> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Nope. "Cisgenic" means "from same species", although some liberal
>>>>>> > interpretations say "same genus". Assume the former. So unless it's
>>>>>> > A.thaliana DNA into another strain/cultivar of A.thaliana, it's
>>>>>> > transgenic.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > On 04/24/2013 10:04 PM, Mega wrote:
>>>>>> >> Newsupdate...
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >> Included this gene into a design which is native to many plant
>>>>>> >> species....
>>>>>> >> http://journals2005.pasteur.ac.ir/NB/23(9)/1177%20-%201180.pdf
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >> Confers resistance to kanamycin when overexpressed. Does not work
>>>>>> >> in bacteria.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >> Could you call such a glowing plant "cisgenic" instead of
>>>>>> >> transgenic ? Because it is a native plant gene (and as a marker
>>>>>> >> not GFP but Lux - but both just optical markers, used many
>>>>>> >> times, not toxic)
>>>>>> >
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>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > -- -Nathan
>>>>>> >
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> - --
>>>>>> Please note my new email: cathal...@cathalgarvey.me
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PGP Key: 988B9099
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>>>>>> Twitter: @onetruecathal
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>>>>>> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://www.enigmail.net/
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> -Nathan
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>>>
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--
-Nathan

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