Re: [DIYbio] Comprehensive Genome Project or Feasibility Thereof

If I had my way with Ireland tomorrow I'd hedge my bets: I'd make one
house pure-sortition, and the other liquid-democracy, and install a
working-group based system instead of canonical "Ministers". Our
presidential office is fine the way it is, honestly; it's just a
figurehead/veto office, we don't have a hegemony at all in that respect.

The whole idea of electing "representatives" makes sense when people
don't want to engage in politics to the extent that everything becomes a
referendum. Having vote-delegating liquid democracy gives a nice middle
ground. Make *everything* a network-mediated referendum, and allow
people to delegate their uncast votes to someone else; this filters up
into a set of "elected representatives", but only insofar as people
don't cast their votes in their local ballot office; in other words,
there is a fluid "government" only as far as the electorate agree with
what they tend to spend their delegated votes on. If they annoy people
enough to reassign their votes, their voting base collapses and they are
out of their (implied) "office".

The sortition-house, meanwhile, have a longer term, allowing them to do
the "difficult", non-populist stuff, and are candidates for "ministry"
working groups. But their term can never be renewed, so there's no
electoral cycle. They have 1-2 years to do what matters, and that's it.
They get paid the median wage of the country according to the most
recent census.

On 21/11/14 17:05, Cory Geesaman wrote:
> The US actually had more of republic overtone earlier on - originally
> the president was a popularity contest, the house was a very localized
> democracy and the senate was put in office by the various state
> governments. The 17th amendment made it so the senate was voted for
> democratically and turned all three branches into a popularity contest
> while removing virtually all state influence at the federal level (and
> all because of the strawman that "it might lead to corruption" if the
> states were allowed to put senators in power instead of making it into a
> popularity contest).
>
> On Friday, November 21, 2014 11:53:34 AM UTC-5, Cathal Garvey wrote:
>
> I think the problem is "electorate". Elections mean popularity
> contests,
> and that attracts and rewards a certain type of person.
>
> The Athenians used sortition. Democracy isn't always electoral. I'll
> wager electoral democracies have the odds stacked against equitable
> governance from the outset, based on my observations of my own country
> and virtually every other Anglophone nation out there.
>
> Hanging politicians will just breed better liars; evolution, etcetera.
>
> On 21/11/14 13:42, Matt Lawes wrote:
> > Perhaps if we hung corrupt politicians?
> > It would take a lot of rope and some time. But we would end up with
> > representatives of the electorate.
> > >matt
> >
> > /Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID/
> >
> >
> > Brian Degger <brian....@gmail.com <javascript:>> wrote:
> >
> > Cathal,
> > One of those Feindishly Devilish Problems .. how to stop the
> trickle up ;)
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Nov 21, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Cathal Garvey
> > <cathal...@cathalgarvey.me <javascript:>> wrote:
> > > Essential problem here: You can't, as a politician, invest in
> > "science and
> > > technology" personally and then invest state funds in the
> field to make
> > > yourself a billionaire. But you can for many industries; oil
> and gas,
> > > copyright, and war. And it just so happens that War is one of
> the most
> > > reliable ways to achieve this, because you aren't just abusing
> your
> > > political position to twist the market, you can also abuse your
> > position to
> > > twist diplomacy and encourage a war.
> > >
> > > Also, due to your influence, Copyright Inc might get a
> proportional
> > boost,
> > > but they were in business before and after your influence. In
> > peacetime, War
> > > Inc is worth little, but when you start a war, the proportional
> > increase in
> > > share value is sudden and drastic.
> > >
> > > So, logically, investing in War Inc and starting a war is the
> best
> > bet for a
> > > powerful and influential politician, who (thanks to her ape
> brain) is
> > > already probably a sociopath because of the weight of the
> authority she
> > > bears, making that logical investment decision easier to make.
> > >
> > > Where is your invisible hand, now? Markets, shares and
> investment kill as
> > > surely as Tomahawks.
> > >
> > > On 21/11/14 02:05, Dakota Hamill wrote:
> > >>
> > >> The defense budget fucks my mind. Put 500 billion into science,
> > >> engineering, and education for one year and people wouldn't
> want to kill
> > >> each other because everyone's problems would be solved in a
> year. Its
> > >> just so sad the amount we spend to prepare for killing each
> other. At
> > >> our stage of nuclear development a world war would be the
> end, so it's
> > >> not conducive for any superpower to go to war. We should
> invest in
> > >> technology, but no scientists want to be politicians because
> its fucking
> > >> corrupt
> > >>
> > >> On Nov 20, 2014 8:57 PM, "Dakota Hamill" <dko...@gmail.com
> <javascript:>
> > >> <mailto:dko...@gmail.com <javascript:>>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Murca
> > >>
> > >> On Nov 20, 2014 8:56 PM, "Brian Degger"
> <brian....@gmail.com <javascript:>
> > >> <mailto:brian....@gmail.com <javascript:>>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> And a tomahawk missile costs $1.4 million (and
> Raytheon has sold
> > >> 2000 of them)
> > >>
> > >> On 21 Nov 2014 01:52, "Brian Degger"
> <brian....@gmail.com <javascript:>
> > >> <mailto:brian....@gmail.com <javascript:>>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Rosetta cost $900 million+
> > >> So $500 million seems almost cheap.
> > >>
> > >> On 21 Nov 2014 01:32, "Dakota Hamill"
> <dko...@gmail.com <javascript:>
> > >> <mailto:dko...@gmail.com <javascript:>>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Sequencing all species on earth would cost
> more than 500
> > >> million dollars unless I'm missing something
> > >>
> > >> De novo is harder and more costly than
> resequencing, but
> > >> not AFAIK by a factor of ten. So it seems
> Cory may be
> > >> close to the mark, but the actual cost becomes
> > >> person-hours, because de-novo certainly
> requires more
> > >> *work*, and that's before you discuss assembly.
> > >>
> > >> Nanopore may be just the ticket: extremely
> long, fast
> > >> reads potentially in the field. Perfect for
> low-pass
> > >> firehose sequence generation.
> > >>
> > >> On 20 November 2014 16:16:27 GMT+00:00, "Mega
> [Andreas
> > >> Stuermer]" <masters...@gmail.com <javascript:>
> > >> <mailto:masters...@gmail.com <javascript:>>>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Sequencing won't be that low for de novo
> > sequencing of
> > >> species I guess (?)
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail.
> Please excuse
> > >> my brevity.
> > >>
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