Re: [DIYbio] Re: WHO statement on roundup

After digging a bit I think this is the document all the news reports are stemming from:

http://www.iarc.fr/en/media-centre/iarcnews/pdf/MonographVolume112.pdf

And this seems to be the key statement:

"For the herbicide glyphosate, there was limited evidence of carcinogenicity in humans for non-Hodgkin lymphoma. The evidence in humans is from studies of exposures, mostly agricultural, in the USA, Canada, and Sweden published since 2001. In addition, there is convincing evidence that glyphosate also can cause cancer in laboratory animals. On the basis of tumours in mice, the United States Environmental Protection Agency (US EPA) originally classified glyphosate as possibly carcinogenic to humans (Group C) in 1985. After a re-evaluation of that mouse study, the US EPA changed its classification to evidence of non-carcinogenicity in humans (Group E) in 1991. The US EPA Scientific Advisory Panel noted that the re-evaluated glyphosate results were still significant using two statistical tests recommended in the IARC Preamble. The IARC Working Group that conducted the evaluation considered the significant findings from the US EPA report and several more recent positive results in concluding that there is sufficient evidence of carcinogenicity in experimental animals. Glyphosate also caused DNA and chromosomal damage in human cells, although it gave negative results in tests using bacteria. One study in community residents reported increases in blood markers of chromosomal damage (micronuclei) after glyphosate formulations were sprayed nearby."

and then later:

"Glyphosate currently has the highest global production volume of all herbicides. The largest use worldwide is in agriculture. The agricultural use of glyphosate has increased sharply since the development of crops that have been genetically modified to make them resistant to glyphosate. Glyphosate is also used in forestry, urban, and home applications. Glyphosate has been detected in the air during spraying, in water, and in food. The general population is exposed primarily through residence near sprayed areas, home use, and diet, and the level that has been observed is generally low."

It sounds to me like the problem is over-use and misuse and the main groups affected are those working or living in or nearby massive agricultural zones. 

I believe the details will be available in the forthcoming monograph volume 112 which will be posted here when its available:

http://monographs.iarc.fr/ENG/Monographs/PDFs/index.php

I'll keep an eye out...

On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 7:58 AM, Cathal Garvey <cathalgarvey@cathalgarvey.me> wrote:

Not to mention that agricultural exposure is already well studied and known to have a nonzero risk of harm, that's why agri workers are supposed to wear protective gear. Even then, the risks are quite low compared to other reasonably-comparable herbicides.

The risks for actual consumers of agriproduce aren't seriously considered here, and are already well established as "next to negligible".

No fan of big agrichem here, but after looking over Glyphosate's safety record and reaching my own conclusion in line with the consensus, I started using it judiciously in my own permaculture plots, in directly-applied gel form.

Given that it's literally just Glycine with a phosphate group, I'm disappointed that nobody's explored ways of cooking it up with some backyard chemistry and food-grade ingredients; I think it'd be *great fun* to distribute a "organic recipe for all natural herbicide" to hippies which is secretly just a way to make the Glyphosate they fart on about so much.

On 24/03/15 12:54, Brian Degger wrote:

Seems it was based on studies..."based on agricultural exposure."
Things to note:
   1) correlation is not the same as causation.
   2) there are no numbers and no link to the science papers.
   3) because of that we can't say anything about the doses that people
were being exposed to.
   4) does that mean that this food will give you cancer? seems not so
highly likely.

On Tue, Mar 24, 2015 at 3:19 AM, Jonathan Cline <jcline@ieee.org

<mailto:jcline@ieee.org>> wrote:

    "nasty and dismissive" is your interpretation of my simple question
    though your "definitely neither" suggests you are happy not to have
    either of those employers.  Do you have a personal bias regarding
    this news or regarding Monsanto?  If so, opinions from the community
    would also become biased by the same.  For example, as my reply has
    already run through bias, via your eyes.

    "a community I respect" - well, there's a problem worth talking
    about too.

    Now I'm gonna venture guesses that you're an artist, have a social
    science degree (at best), and vote Democrat.  Which is topical since
    anyone's opinion is best given depth by the origins of their
    personal background.  I guessed artist because of a projected
    distaste for "mainstream media" and Democrat because of the
    implication of a source of antagonism after a simple & logical
    question, and social science because both of these also imply lack
    of training in critical thinking skills.  'k, cool.  At least the
    Turing test passes.


    My immediate thoughts after reading the news report (first saw it in
    bbc online), was:
      - geez why'd this take so long...  oh.  biologists.   well, and
    human time lines, but.. mostly, biologists.
      - where's the reference, how come the journalist didn't link the
    reference?!
      - oh, probably because the study is statistics bunk anyway
      - especially compared to the arsenic overdose I'm getting from my
    U.S. grown rice
      - which doesn't matter because Monsanto will continue doing what
    they're doing (until public opinion causes a change)
      - and no one REALLY cares about human longevity anyway
      - especially because veganism is the only current antidote to
    cancer and look how the article didn't mention that


    ## Jonathan Cline

    ##jcline@ieee.org  <mailto:jcline@ieee.org>
    ## Mobile:+1-805-617-0223  <tel:%2B1-805-617-0223>
    ########################

    On 3/23/15 7:50 PM, Heather Dewey-Hagborg wrote:

    On Mon, Mar 23, 2015 at 9:00 PM, Jonathan Cline <jncline@gmail.com
    <mailto:jncline@gmail.com>> wrote:



        On Monday, March 23, 2015 at 4:56:42 PM UTC-7, Heather wrote:

            What do you think about this? Big news today. Curious
            about impressions from the community.

            http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/mar/21/roundup-cancer-who-glyphosate-


        Where do you work:  for Monsanto, or for a news agency?


    wow. because I'm interested in what the reaction is from a
    community I respect? because I want to hear opinions outside the
    mainstream media? seems like an unnecessarily nasty and dismissive
    response. I'm definitely neither of those things.



        ## Jonathan Cline
        ## jcline@ieee.org <mailto:jcline@ieee.org>
        ## Mobile: +1-805-617-0223 <tel:%2B1-805-617-0223>
        ########################

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